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Post by uncleal on Feb 13, 2009 20:02:19 GMT -5
Hi Uncleal; Thanks for your kindness, Please tell me about you and your goal;s in life. I myself am from Canada ,living in Alberta, and my trade is a Mason, Married to a lovely wife for 23 years and have one pretty Daughter,sorry all ready taken bud. Compo Pleased to meet you. My name is Al. I'm 62 and live in Florida with my wife, Judy, who I've been with for 34 years. My two children are Vinny (age 42) and Lisa (31). I'm semi retired. I work part time as a personal trainer for disabled adults. My goals are to serve the Lord in accordance with Matthew 25:34-36 , and to deadlift 500 and total 1100 in the 165 lb class within 18 months.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2009 20:52:03 GMT -5
uncleal; I hope you you master your goals my friend ,for the lord is our strength Amen to that. Also I would like to say, I set myself a personal record 3 days ago at the gym. can you believe I benched 365 pounds 3 times, blew me away and my spotter and others around. I said to the guys did a space ship land during the night when I was sleeping and give me some space power juice and don't know it. PEACE BE WITH YOU AND YOUR FAMILY ;UNCLEAL; Compo
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Post by uncleal on Feb 14, 2009 9:22:26 GMT -5
Same to you, buddy. Congratulations on the awesome bench press PR!
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Post by jesseisrael on Feb 14, 2009 13:00:16 GMT -5
I have been thinking about this and came to the conclusion that I am not any weaker than I was in my 20's, I will be 46 in April but I have more things on my plate and my priorities have changed. I remember putting my head through the wall at the gym in my 20's when I missed a squat....yes, I was on steroids at the time. If I miss a lift or a training day for that matter now, it really is no big deal. I don't train sick any longer. I have other interests. Powerlifting is fun for me now but not an obsession. Perhaps this is what happens to us. If we had the single minded drive and dedication and willingness to fight through injury, sickness and the like, I am sure that we would be just as strong if not stronger but life gets in the way. Good lifting to all. ;D
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Post by RichHutchison on Feb 14, 2009 13:37:27 GMT -5
Not trying to be a smart aleck here, but it’s probably an inherent trait that I don’t have to strive for.
I can’t believe that this is a debatable issue. 1. Do you think you’ll be as strong at 80 as you are now? 2. Why do you think they came up with Age Factors for Masters lifters? 3. Why do you think that ALL of the Masters Records in ALL of the federations decrease in direct proportion to age?
So isn't the only issue WHEN, not IF, your strength starts to decline? Until you're in your mid 40s, depending on what you start with, you can probably add a significant amount of muscle mass. That's why the Sub-Masters category is a complete joke.
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Post by jesseisrael on Feb 14, 2009 14:12:40 GMT -5
Rich, Of course we lose strength, some of us cognitive function, sexual function and control over our bladder if we live long enough You are right, it is not if but when. I prefer to be in the when category. If one can stay healthy then the decline seems to be slower. Just look at yourself, Bob Cortes, Fred Archembault, etc. The idea, ideally is to set yourself up to be upright at 80 and beyond. I am not loony enough to believe that I can do as well in the open as the master's anymore than I would do as well at a non-tested event as at a tested one. ;D
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Post by RichHutchison on Feb 14, 2009 19:13:28 GMT -5
Hmm... I may have to retire sooner than later. I don't think Depends are legal in raw lifting.
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Post by uncleal on Feb 15, 2009 15:37:26 GMT -5
Rich - After my third "accident", they not only allow them, but made Depends mandatory for guys our age. Jesse - You're still a Hulkster. With that new routine of yours, I think you're going to set open PL records while qualifying for the Mr. Olympia.
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jp
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Post by jp on Feb 15, 2009 17:06:21 GMT -5
Thanks, John. That's pretty much in concert with a routine that old icon, Bob Gaynor, suggested for me. He likes the 3x3 wave, where you move up for four weeks, then drop back to week 2 and start another four week progression; for example: Week 1: 275x3x3 Week 2: 285x3x3 Week 3: 295x3x3 Week 4: 305x3x3 Week 5: 285x3x3 Week 6: 295x3x3 Week 7: 305x3x3 Week 8: 315x3x3, etc. It's working great for the squat, but in all honesty, it overtrains my deadlift. My CNS can't do consecutive weeks off the floor, once I move into the 90% 1RM range. Alternating with rack pulls works much better. That sounds like a good plan. Slow and steady is the way to go. I'm sort of following an idea based on the Ricky Dale Crain routines for masters lifters. In his correspondence to me he said when his dad was powerlifting, as his dad got older, he noticed that the only way for his dad to maintain his strength level was to keep his weights at or slightly above the 80% level and to work in shorter cycles with some cycles being no longer than 4-6 weeks. His dad didn't back cycle too far. He stayed with no less than 80% on his weights. The only thing that changed was the cycle's duration. Reason being that when we were younger, we could cycle back further and start at a lower percentage; down at 60-65%. We could take longer to build up and stay in peak form longer. As we age, we loose the ability to do that, so higher percentages and shorter cycles are the order of the day. If you drop back too far, you'll notice it becomes a real hurdle to get back to where you previously were. This was the mistake I previously made on following some bad advice. Once I was able to get back to within 80% of where I was, working up to max singles wasn't a problem. I noticed this in my own training and maintain that your training must be modified over the years, especially if you've been training consistently since your teens or 20's with little or no breaks. If one starts training later in life the rules change a bit. I also noticed I needed to do less and less assistance work, with little more than a couple of different assistance exercises after the main lift for the day. My body felt better overall when just hitting the lifts. You're right though about those waves cycles......they can knock the Hades out of you. A couple of ideas for the deadlift I tried that worked was to drop my deadlift training back to once in 10-14 days when training for a meet, and once in 8-10 days when training during the off season. Reason for the difference was the percentages were higher (of course) during meet training. Another idea for the deadlift was to train it every week, say once every 7 days like in a typical powerlifting program, but train one day heavy with the wave cycle like you suggested and the next week instead of the rack pulls (which for me really overload my body) deadlift again, but only up to the 80% range. That way, you truly get a heavy deadlift workout only once in 14 days while still maintaining a once a week deadlift schedule. Just an idea....=) Cheers, John
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Post by uncleal on Feb 16, 2009 15:01:33 GMT -5
Thanks so much for the detailed analysis, John. I'll definitely chew on it.
The short cycle comment has a lot of merit for me when it comes to bench pressing. I generally peak within six weeks.
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jp
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Post by jp on Feb 18, 2009 14:27:38 GMT -5
Thanks so much for the detailed analysis, John. I'll definitely chew on it. The short cycle comment has a lot of merit for me when it comes to bench pressing. I generally peak within six weeks. Same here.... I tried going twice a week with it and it seems to just halt progress. I started using heavy military presses once a week as well, on a different day than the BP's and its helped a lot.
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jp
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Post by jp on Feb 18, 2009 14:33:30 GMT -5
Not trying to be a smart aleck here, but it’s probably an inherent trait that I don’t have to strive for. I can’t believe that this is a debatable issue. 1. Do you think you’ll be as strong at 80 as you are now? 2. Why do you think they came up with Age Factors for Masters lifters? 3. Why do you think that ALL of the Masters Records in ALL of the federations decrease in direct proportion to age? So isn't the only issue WHEN, not IF, your strength starts to decline? Until you're in your mid 40s, depending on what you start with, you can probably add a significant amount of muscle mass. That's why the Sub-Masters category is a complete joke. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Right on Rich!! Finally, someone with a clue!! LOL!!! However, there's still a few hard headed folks a page or two back that still think they'll be pulling/pushing and squatting the same weights in the future that they're doing right now. Kudos to them!! Gentlemen, place your bets.....anyone want to give any odds on this subject? LOL!!
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Post by RichHutchison on Feb 18, 2009 15:12:33 GMT -5
I agree with JP. BS!!And yes, you're killing me too. Look at the record books, guys. If we believe that we get stronger as we age, then there should be age handicaps for younger lifters for Best Masters Lifter trophies. If you're stronger now than ever, and you're over 45, you started out weak.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2009 15:46:38 GMT -5
If you're stronger now than ever, and you're over 45, you started out weak. [/quote] OK. You seem to know so much. I started in Spring 2005.Age 44 Got 365 off my chest in 2 months time in the198 class. My first 100% RAW Meet set the World Record (at that time) 385 bench. AGE 45. The next April. 2006 BW 202.5 Benched 420. Tore rotator cuff. Fall 2007 back training again. Yada yada Fall 2008 BW 213.2 Bench 455. Middle of winter 2009. T&G 495. Just getting ready for a 500lb load up. Your theory. I stated week with a class world record. And now I am? what were I should be. So around 500 is were every 214 BW lifter should be on the bench. After all. I started off weak!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2009 15:50:58 GMT -5
I will take that bet. When I'm 49, I will be benching more than I am now. By the way. Masters 40-44 is weaker than masters 45-49 in the 220 class. Trust me on this.
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jp
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Post by jp on Feb 18, 2009 19:30:48 GMT -5
If you're stronger now than ever, and you're over 45, you started out weak. OK. You seem to know so much. I started in Spring 2005.Age 44 Got 365 off my chest in 2 months time in the198 class. My first 100% RAW Meet set the World Record (at that time) 385 bench. AGE 45. The next April. 2006 BW 202.5 Benched 420. Tore rotator cuff. Fall 2007 back training again. Yada yada Fall 2008 BW 213.2 Bench 455. Middle of winter 2009. T&G 495. Just getting ready for a 500lb load up. Your theory. I stated week with a class world record. And now I am? what were I should be. So around 500 is were every 214 BW lifter should be on the bench. After all. I started off weak![/quote] OK....so you're 45 and benching nearly 500 pounds??? I'm pretty sure you're the anomaly in the group and one who never, ever, ever struggles......sorry, but a person with a 500 pound bench shouldn't even be commenting on this thread.....LOL!!! Geez!! 500 pounds??!! 500?? You got 365 in two months of training??? Kudos to you sir!!! And, you never, ever trained with weights before 2005? Oh and a torn rotator cuff too??? You're killin' me dude! John
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jp
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Post by jp on Feb 18, 2009 19:31:49 GMT -5
I agree with JP. BS!!And yes, you're killing me too. Look at the record books, guys. If we believe that we get stronger as we age, then there should be age handicaps for younger lifters for Best Masters Lifter trophies. If you're stronger now than ever, and you're over 45, you started out weak. He's benching 500 now......post torn rotator cuff!! Amazing!!
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Post by RichHutchison on Feb 18, 2009 20:11:15 GMT -5
Blackstone, you're doing great, and you've come on quickly. But according to what I read, you were basically a beginner at 44. Who knows what you could have done if you had trained harder sooner.
You're on the cusp of what (I think) is the age at which most guys have trouble gaining muscle mass - late 40s.
Yes, I know there are inconsistencies in the records; ups and downs in the charts, but the trends are obvious. I believe that increased participation, more competition, etc. will eliminate those bumps and smooth the curves.
I sympathize with the rotator. Not fun. I had a tendon repaired and reattached also. And now I'm stuck with benching with a 16 inch wide grip, which is narrow even for my short arms. I'm sure that't the only reason I'm not doing 500. ;D
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Post by 3speed on Feb 18, 2009 20:26:00 GMT -5
I think the problem here is that generalizations are being made. You have to realize that there will always be exceptions.
I have been lifting since I was 13. I have been lifting seriously and competing in powerlifting since I was 22. I realize that I may be an exception but, I am I am stronger now than I have ever been. My raw numbers now are in the same neighbor where my equipped numbers were in the early 90's.
You can attribute it to genetics, to improved mental strength, to better training techniques, or whatever else you want. The fact is, I am much stronger now than when I was half my current age. I fully understand that this will not always be the case. I fully understand that I will reach a point where I will regress. However, I absolutely believe that, as long as I can stay healthy, I can still advance my strength for another 5 or 6 years.
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Post by jesseisrael on Feb 18, 2009 20:42:25 GMT -5
John and Rich, Lighten up brothers. There are going to be some that improve while others maintain and others lose in increments as they age. I don't believe that most here believe that they will be as strong at 75 as they are at 45 but they will more than likely be quite a bit stronger than their non training counterparts. I am ecstatic that there are Master's classes as I don't beleive that I can be consitently competitive with people 20= years younger than I am. As a former Boxer, I do know that your punch is that last thing to go. I believe that this translates to your power as well as long as your connective tissue holds up.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2009 22:18:23 GMT -5
Why yes I am amazing! LOL!! GODS will. It is actually possible for people to do things that others would not try. Have you ever heard the stories about those who have no right doing certain things and they go way beyond? I'm not near saying thats what I'm doing. Its just possible to go beyond what others refuse to try. Some nights I actually cry myself to sleep. Yes the pain is unsurmountable at times. So what. I love this sport and wont let some knife happy Doctor cut his way into my end. If you look up the Illinois and World records along with National. You can follow my lifting career. Look at the years and don't confuse them with months. Please read carefully before making uneducated statements. If you have any further questions about what I am all about. Look at my log. It was Blackstone's push for 500. Now it is, new goal 505. Eventually I will strive for 525 and then 540. With your belief or not. So please do not confuse your self limitations to my abilities.
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Post by RichHutchison on Feb 19, 2009 9:45:10 GMT -5
Jesse, You're telling us to lighten up? Now that IS insulting! ;D
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Post by jesseisrael on Feb 19, 2009 10:59:41 GMT -5
Thanks Rich I really did need that belly laugh ;D Hey, maybe it is a possibility that we just train smarter as we age. Possibly if Bill Blackstone had started earlier he could have been a legitimate 600 raw bencher. Who knows? I have known Bob Cortes for about 20 years and have seen the decline to be sure but it wasn't all that noticeable until post 75 years of age. I think that I would still take a 450 dead at 150 pounds at 78 though. Hades, I would take that now..
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2009 15:44:57 GMT -5
Thanks Rich I really did need that belly laugh ;D Hey, maybe it is a possibility that we just train smarter as we age. Possibly if Bill Blackstone had started earlier he could have been a legitimate 600 raw bencher. Who knows? .. 600!! I was thinking 550. With all the if ands or buts. New goal added. 500-525-540-550-600 Thanks for nothing
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jp
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Post by jp on Feb 21, 2009 13:27:36 GMT -5
John and Rich, Lighten up brothers. I am light.....183 pounds!! LOL!!! John
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