Stop w/ all the programming!

[osu122975]

Use 25's and 45's and occasionally 10's when you're trying to up your 1RM, but mostly 25's and 45's. Train as heavy as possible as often as possible. Use only bench, squat, DL, press and some type of row movement. Train DL and overhead press one day and squat and bench the next day throwing in some rows here and there. No isolation movements or compound variation movements like curls or good mornings, etc.

Stop w/ all the percentages and get back to moving some weight. Percentages are for those who want to be restricted. You move weight, not percentages. Gauge your progress by reps at a particular weight.

For example: if you can do 275x3 bench press, there's no reason you can't do 295x1. Once you get 295x3, you should be capable of 315x1 and so on. Focus on technique and moving the weight.

I fell into programming and jumped too much. The reason? They are too restrictive and boring. Maybe I'm just undisciplined when it comes to programs, but I LOVE just throwing weight on the bar and moving it.

Also, move up fast between sets. No need beat around the bush. Light weight doesn't build muscle or speed, no matter what others may say. You never lift a heavy weight slow - you try and push it as hard and fast as possible. You aren't learning to be slow as they say. That's hogwash.

For example: my last squat workout
Bar x 10 135x2x5 225x5 315x3 365x1 405x1(PR)

I knew this session I was hoping for 405 and if 365 (which I normally do for 2-3 reps) felt light for a single, I was gonna try 405, which went up very quick. If I'm just looking to move weight and not set a record, I would do 315x5 and 365x3. When I get 365x5 I'll go 425, which I think I could hit now. Once I get 405x3, I'd probably try 455x1.

It's an easy and extremely effective way to gain strength w/o overkill each workout. Make your body adapt to the loads that are being placed upon it. You will find that you won't be as worn out as you might think since you won't be doing as many reps or any extra accessory stuff. This is STRENGTH building. It will adapt. Olympic weight lifters train 6x / wk. using the same mentality and most of them are stronger than most raw lifters w/ the exception maybe of bench press.

Give it a try. At least for a change of pace.

[dbunch]

I want to caveat my reply with “do what works for you”. With that being said I firmly believe that the most efficient and effective way to reach a goal is to Plan, Execute, Measure, and Adjust. Have a plan; know what you going to train and how you’re going to train.

Plan: Over all my best training day are the ones where I have a good plan of what I’m going to do and what my goal for that day as well as the future are, keeping in mind that my future goals are far more important than today’s goals. I will also tend to get more done in less time if I have a plan.

Execute: When you train, stick to you plan, This doesn’t mean you can’t take advantage of a day where you are feeling really good and add some extra sets or reps. but keep true to the plan. Going what I call “all Cowboy” in you training may lead to some very impressive training days but in the long hall I think it’s most likely to lead to injuries. The only time (again my opinion) it is worth it to go all out is on the platform.

Measure: This is where most people fail. I think a lot of people thing to journal/log is a waste of time but it’s vital to identify you successes and failures. You can’t measure if you don’t have good data. If you’re not consistent in you training you’re not going to have good data. Review what you have been doing and see what is working and what isn’t.

Adjust: This one is simple, based on the data you’ve collected make the necessary changes and continue.

In the long hall I believe that a person will see bigger and better results with fewer injuries with a well-executed plan.

[zekester]

I use to plan out my workouts months in advance, only to make changes as I adapted to what my body was feeling and my recovery time...I now plan my workout at the beginning of the week for that week and usually stick close to that for a few weeks, but i treat it as a guideline not the gospel...I do use percentages at times, but only as a starting point, especially on lifts or set and rep range Im not familar with and or trying something new...Lately, my workouts generally consist of one heavy, one supplemental, one accessory, one re-hab and if I do a second pressing day in the week I will do 2 supplementals, 1 accessory, 1 rehab, oh yeah and stetching!...Lately, I also have one day where I just Squat & Deadlift heavy, thats it for that workout...Then a back day may be rack pulls, shrug, 1 arm row and band pull-a-parts...The rehab work and stretching has been very beneficial to my ability to continue lifting, staying injury free and mostly pain free, and has increased my range of motion to where holding a barbell behind my head comfortably is now possible...Im 53 years old and cant do workouts like I use to, but now my knowledge and experience, sometimes learned the hard way has enabled me to be stronger than I was at any point in my life...

[stinee67]

OSU I agree just move the weight.
If the weight feels good at 315 x 3 then move up in weight. I'm 63 and my bench I start at the bar 12 reps then go up to 225 x 5 , 275 x 5, 295 x 1, 315 x 2 and then go up to 335 or 355 what ever feels good.

[zekester]

Stinee...you go from the bar to 225?...I cant do that...lol...I got to progress up from 135 then 185 until I try 225, even then it feels heavy...lol...Recently, Ive also tried changing grip width as I move up and use my competition grip when I get closer to my max {405}...

[mikefrost]

Great posts everyone. I agree with the OP, get back to the basics. Its funny seeing how far some guys can deviate from the actual powerlifts with the hope of "carry over". One legged RDL's on a Bosu Ball haha. Were powerlifting not doing brain surgery.

I believe it helps to perform small cycles(strength/power/max/ect.) but this is for developing a base and not overloading. Percentages I'm not a huge fan of because it does limit a lifter, last week I was doing board press(1 board) as my main exercise and just felt like it was a potential rep PR day so I went for it and got it. If I had followed another generic PL program I may have had to perform the same reps with 12% less weight, I don't think thats how stars are made.

The old iron powerhouses interest me alot, specifically guys like Dave Shaw are a big influence along with Bill Starr and Marty Gallagher. Dave Shaw trained the bent over row as a fourth powerlift as did Dave Draper with great success. The OP is dead on....."squat,bench,dead,standing press,row......this is similar to the starr/madcow workout and it works. Heavy bent over rows performed correctly(back parralel to the floor, touching abs/low chest every rep) works wonders, it helps the deadlift and bench alot. I strongly suggest this exercise, perhaps even training it like a fourth lift.

[George]

I like percentage training and programs as guides specifically because they do "restrict". When left to my gut, I typically push things until I overtrain or need a back off week, or tweak a peck.

The key word is "guide". The 5x5, Korte, Sheiko...whatever it is is simply based on observations of what works on several test runs and averaged out. I see nothing wrong with using such information to help design a personalized routine. It is up to the lifter to determine the intangibles, such as wether the routine is better for enhanced, veteran, specialist among others coupled with the lifters own style of adaptation, body type, caloric and supplemental intake/recovery ability.

Somewhere down the line, people who are effectively training are likely using principles set forth from some form of program or routine, or an observation of multiple routines that produced success. Percentages are easy to make. For example, a veteran lifter who opted to try a Coan style peak could look at his 13 week progression and guage his own numbers along with Coans.

Percentages could even be made of the opening post. For example...
275 x 3 (93%) is good for 295 (100%) x 1
295 x 3 (93%) is good for 315 (100%) x 1

Therefore, while it makes sense to argue that programming and percentages may hinder a lifter, any time a statement like the above is made, percentages almost need applied to see if they are true. For example, a 400 bencher can use the above and agree "yea...I get 380 for 3 so thats about right". Not using percentages means going by feel and technically guessing, both of which, to me, can have more disastrous results than a restrictive program. Whether or not the results are worse than an over reaching program is up to interpretation.

No matter how special a lifter feels, when looking at percentage break downs there are elements of one or more theories at work from dynamic mixing, with 90% (Louie), to training with 5 reps (Starr, Coan) to tapering and all points in between. Over the years there is simply a formula that begins to develop for each lifter that, while various, have a certain carry over to specific lifters. Choosing to avoid these observations and simply going by feel, and not looking into what successful lifters have employed by comparing percentages, seems to miss the mark.

Lifting, like anything else, is a process with many steps with a high chance of the need for adaptation. Any person going through such a process should look to those with experience, the more successful the better (or closer in style) to gain insight. I would not know the first thing about flying as plane but you can guarantee fi someone held my family and demanded I learn how to fly in a month, I'm going to find the best Duckies pilot I can to teach me before just hoping into planes and riding frantic circles around the zone and crashing into the hillside over and over. There's a great chance that what the pilot shows me is tried and true among other pilots...else they would have crashed into oblivion as well.

[Deleted]

you could say im for programs but not entirely.
you do need to keep track of your weights to check your progress.
keep it simple to remember.
lifting just 45 plates and 25 plates. will yield great results but bigger consequences. shoulder and elbow injuries for bench. knees injuries for squat. core and shoulder injuries for dead lift.

you do need somewhat of a program so that you dont lift randomly at the gym.
and always ask the "why" then "how"

"why"
why do people do close grip. it builds better tricep power, medial head. great results but each inch your grip moves in from the normal grip, you put more pressure on elbows.

"how" part
do an equivalent exercise that hits the same muscle but more safe.
learn how to properly do that exercise

[osu122975]

The point is....

Some lifters get so attached to their percentages and limitations in programs they spend excessive amounts of time trying to program rather than getting in and moving some weight.

I don't really follow the Bulgarian method to the tee, but it certainly has it's benefits - particularly if you know how to use it to your advantage.

There is nothing wrong w/ going heavy (85% or more) everyday. Limit your accessory because let's face it.....just like olympic lifting, powerlifting is training movements. The injury rate is not high if you allow yourself ample recovery, which means the main lift and maybe one assistance movement. Keep the reps low and train more often. This is how the Bulgarians trained and they had a lot of success with it.

This is my training template:
Day 1 - bench and heavy db rows paused
Day 2 - squat and weighted back raises
Day 3 - slingshot bench and neutral grip pullups or wide grip pulldowns paused
Day 4 - deadlift and heavy t-bar rows paused at top
***then repeat with maybe a day off in between***

I have no injuries and my lifts continue to climb.

There is no guess work as to where you are. Training heavy often allows you to have a legitimate test whenever you want because your nervous system will always be relatively ramped up. You won't need 10 weeks to build up to it to figure it out.

Good lifters listen to their body and move weight. It's not instictive training if you're always using 45/25/10lb plates as the basis for your increases. Set a goal in mind each session and go for it.

Percentages are great for a basis of theory, but in reality - even w/ dynamic work, it's about bar speed, not the percentage of weight. So using percentages are a great place to start - but staying there will limit you.

[Deleted]

yes there are people who do unnecessary lifts. excess lifting just hurts the body.
its just routines and a simple chart allows a better visual of your gains.

like 5x320 on bench this week and then 5x325 on bench next week. is a gain you can see progression. 5 lb increase

random lifting like.
4x325 this week and 3x335 the next week.
the rep and weight is different. its not easy to see the gains. you may think your lifting more but your doing less rep.
theres more example but ehh.

you might not have injuries but heavy lifting all the time is a gamble to your body. maybe your just lucky at the moment.

since you dont do programs. do you keep track of your gains, like monthly or every 2 months.

average 5 lbs a week is the normal gains.

[osu122975]

Here's my basic template:
Sets 1-3 warmup under 60%
Sets 4-7 work up to a heavy single (85% or more)
Sets 8-9 drop 40lbs for 2x3
Sets 10-11 add 15-20lbs for 2x2

Bench example:
45x25 135x2x8 225x3 275x1 315x1 335x1 355x1 315x2x3 335x2x2.

The only thing I keep track of is my 1RM progress at 2-3 month intervals since I compete. The rest of the time is putting in work. Weekly gains mean nothing.

The heavy single for the day is based on bar speed and form of the lift. If a lift slows down or form suffers, I base the rest of the workout from that weight. This allows for autoregulation.

Injuries are more common with rep guys. Technique breaks down easier the more reps you do. With heavy weight/low reps, the speed and technique can both be near perfect and therefore a lower risk of injury. It's all the extra bodybuilding stuff afterwards that takes its toll on the body.

I'm a competitive powerlifter and my goal is the biggest 1RM I can achieve. The longer it takes me to recover from a workout, that's just another day I'm getting weaker. Olympic lifters lift everyday. They do 5-6 movements total training and that's about it. In powerlifting, we are also training movements. If we don't get good with the heavy weight and get our bodies used to it, we won't amount to much. That is why the Russian and Bulgarian and every other country has kicked out butts in lifting year after year. They train using this philosophy. The USA still uses progressive overload for their lifters. John Broz aims to change that.

I do listen to my body. If it needs a day or so off, I do it. But honestly, I rarely need it. The human body has so much potential but we'll never know until we push the boundaries. I find I'm a lot less sore doing this than doing a typical powerlifting/bodybuilding program.