jp
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Posts: 183
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Post by jp on Feb 12, 2009 16:30:15 GMT -5
OK...so....here's what I've noticed about my training and wondered if other master's lifters out there noticed the same thing:
I went from full body, three day a week workouts that lasted roughly an hour and a half to a 4 day a week workout with each training day lasting at most 30-35 minutes.
I noticed when I trained full body three days a week, physically, I felt better....meaning I felt like I had worked out. I obviously had that all over systemic tired feeling. After, a few months though, I simply couldn't add any more weight to the bar and started to feel drained. Duh...overtraining!
I went back to my "old style" of training and did ONE major lift per workout. I still wanted to bring up my military press too, so I decided to take a cue from someone here (sorry can't remember who it was) and started the following routine:
Day 1 - Squat and assistance (calf work, leg curls and leg extensions for knee health)
Day 2 - Bench and assistance (triceps work and some chins)
Day 3 - DL and assistance (barbell rows and shrugs)
Day 4 - Military Press and assistance (triceps work)
So the theory of training whole body might be a great idea when:
you're young and have no responsibility;
you recover easily;
and you're goals are only to stay in shape....not powerlift
I have no days in particular to train, except that I try to either train two days in a row then take a day off, or train every other day (which would give me an eight day cycle). So far so good.
My squat is sky rocketing, and the bench, the military press and deadlift are all coming up steadily as well. So much for full body training being a good thing for me....
J
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Post by lysimacus on Feb 12, 2009 18:30:04 GMT -5
At 52 I find that recovery is very important because it takes longer that it once did. I do physical work so I must balance my workout carefully. One major lift and one accessory, no more than two days in a row with a deload every forth week seems to work well for me.
I also try to avoid reps to failure.
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jp
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Posts: 183
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Post by jp on Feb 12, 2009 20:28:12 GMT -5
At 47, that's where I seem to be now, despite still thinking I can do as I once did.
And you're right, definitely no reps to failure otherwise recovery is compromised.
John
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2009 2:52:51 GMT -5
At 47, that's where I seem to be now, despite still thinking I can do as I once did. And you're right, definitely no reps to failure otherwise recovery is compromised. John I as one totally disagree. Lifting to failure is a huge part of power lifting no matter what your age. Recovery is what you make of it. Mind over matter. Diet. Vitamins. Drive and the will. As for working a physical job and lifting also. I have moved household goods (mover)for 32 years and I still lift five days a week. This is not a bragging session. This is one lifters example of what you can do if you let yourself. Go to Blackstones push for 505 in the log threads. One thing left out. My age. 48. Also I have written a short article and it was published by BMF Sports. Just go to there web sight. Hit on articles. You will find it under Bill Blackstone. Again this has nothing to do with anything except. Don't let your mind out think your body. |
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Post by lysimacus on Feb 13, 2009 9:09:49 GMT -5
Blackstone,
Your achievements are impressive and give great weight to your advice. At our age it is imperative that we train with determination.
There are two schools of thought on lifting to failure. Both have demonstrated results. I have chosen to avoid failure because I lift alone and I believe that keeping form solid prevents injury. The injuries I've suffered all came from that one last attempt when I knew I had already reach my limit.
In practice I have not seen much of a problem with failure reps on the bench but the squat and deadlift are more prone to injury from breakdown of form.
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Post by DJ on Feb 13, 2009 12:45:13 GMT -5
I am 44, soon to be 45 and train 4 days a week.
Sun. Chest/Bi's
Mon. Back/Tri's
Wed. Legs
Friday Off Season - Accessory movements or In Season - Strongman or Highland Games training.
This has worked well for me. I am not a one lift lifter or I could probably increase some of the work. I have always trained the 3 PL movements. I do agree though, that I have "toned" things down some compared to my 30's. Recovery time is much slower but I do believe my strict/clean eating and supplement use help also.
And I am talking about normal supplements ie: protein, vitamins, HMB, glutamine, etc.
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Post by RichHutchison on Feb 13, 2009 14:08:10 GMT -5
In case anyone is interested, I'm 68 and I train 6 days a week. Overtrain? What do you think Ibuprofin was invented for? This is the routine that I've morphed into over the years. I like it and it seems to work well enough for me. I claim to know nothing and I recommend nothing.  MON - Chest & Tris, Front and Side Delts ---- - BP Pyramid up & down, "WARM UP, FAIL DOWN" 9 to 11 Sets. ---- - (Not too different from Bossi) ---- - BP Close - 4 Sets to Failure, 20 to 12 Reps. ---- - Pec Dec - 4 Sets to Failure, 20 to 12 Reps. ---- - Tri Pushdown Machine - 4 Sets to Near Failure, ~ 20 Reps. ---- - Tri Cable Pushdown - 2 Sets of ~ 20 each, Palms Down & Reverse ---- - Front and Side Lateral Raises - 2 Sets of ~ 20 each. TUE - Squat (and Calf Raise) ---- - Squat - Sets of 8 - Move up to weight which can be done 8 times or less. ---- - Calf Raise - Who cares? WED - Deadlift (alternate weeks - competition and stiff-leg) ---- - Deadlift - 2 Light 8 Rep Warmup Sets. ---- - .............. 1 Work Set of 10 Reps to Failure at 70% of Max ---- - .............. 1 WorkSet of 6 Reps to Failure at 80% of Max ---- - .............. 1 Single-Rep Test of Strength at 90% of Max ---- - Stiff-Leg - 5 sets of 12 up to weight that kills me to do 12. THU - Same as Monday FRI - Back & Bicep, Rear Delts & Traps - More like bodybuilding stuff ---- - Shrugs, 4 Sets of high reps, 20 to 40. SAT - Squat (and Calf Raise) ---- - Squat - Sets of 4 - Move up to weight which can be done 4 times or less. ---- - Calf Raise - If you didn't care on Tuesday, why would you care now? |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2009 15:22:46 GMT -5
In case anyone is interested, I'm 68 and I train 6 days a week. Overtrain? What do you think Ibuprofin was invented for? This is the routine that I've morphed into over the years. I like it and it seems to work well enough for me. I claim to know nothing and I recommend nothing. MON - Chest & Tris, Front and Side Delts ---- - BP Pyramid up & down, "WARM UP, FAIL DOWN" 9 to 11 Sets. ---- - (Not too different from Bossi) ---- - BP Close - 4 Sets to Failure, 20 to 12 Reps. ---- - Pec Dec - 4 Sets to Failure, 20 to 12 Reps. ---- - Tri Pushdown Machine - 4 Sets to Near Failure, ~ 20 Reps. ---- - Tri Cable Pushdown - 2 Sets of ~ 20 each, Palms Down & Reverse ---- - Front and Side Lateral Raises - 2 Sets of ~ 20 each. TUE - Squat (and Calf Raise) ---- - Squat - Sets of 8 - Move up to weight which can be done 8 times or less. ---- - Calf Raise - Who cares? WED - Deadlift (alternate weeks - competition and stiff-leg) ---- - Deadlift - 2 Light 8 Rep Warmup Sets. ---- - .............. 1 Work Set of 10 Reps to Failure at 70% of Max ---- - .............. 1 WorkSet of 6 Reps to Failure at 80% of Max ---- - .............. 1 Single-Rep Test of Strength at 90% of Max ---- - Stiff-Leg - 5 sets of 12 up to weight that kills me to do 12. THU - Same as Monday FRI - Back & Bicep, Rear Delts & Traps - More like bodybuilding stuff ---- - Shrugs, 4 Sets of high reps, 20 to 40. SAT - Squat (and Calf Raise) ---- - Squat - Sets of 4 - Move up to weight which can be done 4 times or less. ---- - Calf Raise - If you didn't care on Tuesday, why would you care now? Thats what I'm talking about!! Wooooohhhhh YA!~ Don't let ANYBODY talk you into what you cant do!! |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2009 15:28:09 GMT -5
Blackstone, Your achievements are impressive and give great weight to your advice. At our age it is imperative that we train with determination. There are two schools of thought on lifting to failure. Both have demonstrated results. I have chosen to avoid failure because I lift alone and I believe that keeping form solid prevents injury. The injuries I've suffered all came from that one last attempt when I knew I had already reach my limit. In practice I have not seen much of a problem with failure reps on the bench but the squat and deadlift are more prone to injury from breakdown of form. If you only had a P. What you could do! Safety first. I totally agree with you. I go through partners by the dozen. When I have them I abuse them! LOL! And this little sissy ran all the way home WHA WHA WHA  |
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jp
Full Member
Posts: 183
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Post by jp on Feb 13, 2009 20:16:04 GMT -5
At 47, that's where I seem to be now, despite still thinking I can do as I once did. And you're right, definitely no reps to failure otherwise recovery is compromised. John I as one totally disagree. Lifting to failure is a huge part of power lifting no matter what your age. Recovery is what you make of it. Mind over matter. Diet. Vitamins. Drive and the will. As for working a physical job and lifting also. I have moved household goods (mover)for 32 years and I still lift five days a week. This is not a bragging session. This is one lifters example of what you can do if you let yourself. Go to Blackstones push for 505 in the log threads. One thing left out. My age. 48. Also I have written a short article and it was published by BMF Sports. Just go to there web sight. Hit on articles. You will find it under Bill Blackstone. Again this has nothing to do with anything except. Don't let your mind out think your body. But, don't forget.....I weigh considerably less than you do at 175-180 (on a good day) and am ectomorphoric.....so the "mind over matter response" just doesn't work for an ectomorph, especially when it comes from a meso or endomorph......sorry. =( Heard it a million times before..... I applaud you for being able to move furniture during the course of your daily work day, and then be able to still train. I only wish I could do that. I work in law enforcement, and with crappy shifts, crappy sleeping and eating habits, due in part to the crappy shifts, being able to train at all and make gains is a feat unto itself.....LOL!! |
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jp
Full Member
Posts: 183
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Post by jp on Feb 13, 2009 20:18:28 GMT -5
In case anyone is interested, I'm 68 and I train 6 days a week. Overtrain? What do you think Ibuprofin was invented for? This is the routine that I've morphed into over the years. I like it and it seems to work well enough for me. I claim to know nothing and I recommend nothing. MON - Chest & Tris, Front and Side Delts ---- - BP Pyramid up & down, "WARM UP, FAIL DOWN" 9 to 11 Sets. ---- - (Not too different from Bossi) ---- - BP Close - 4 Sets to Failure, 20 to 12 Reps. ---- - Pec Dec - 4 Sets to Failure, 20 to 12 Reps. ---- - Tri Pushdown Machine - 4 Sets to Near Failure, ~ 20 Reps. ---- - Tri Cable Pushdown - 2 Sets of ~ 20 each, Palms Down & Reverse ---- - Front and Side Lateral Raises - 2 Sets of ~ 20 each. TUE - Squat (and Calf Raise) ---- - Squat - Sets of 8 - Move up to weight which can be done 8 times or less. ---- - Calf Raise - Who cares? WED - Deadlift (alternate weeks - competition and stiff-leg) ---- - Deadlift - 2 Light 8 Rep Warmup Sets. ---- - .............. 1 Work Set of 10 Reps to Failure at 70% of Max ---- - .............. 1 WorkSet of 6 Reps to Failure at 80% of Max ---- - .............. 1 Single-Rep Test of Strength at 90% of Max ---- - Stiff-Leg - 5 sets of 12 up to weight that kills me to do 12. THU - Same as Monday FRI - Back & Bicep, Rear Delts & Traps - More like bodybuilding stuff ---- - Shrugs, 4 Sets of high reps, 20 to 40. SAT - Squat (and Calf Raise) ---- - Squat - Sets of 4 - Move up to weight which can be done 4 times or less. ---- - Calf Raise - If you didn't care on Tuesday, why would you care now? Thats what I'm talking about!! Wooooohhhhh YA!~ Don't let ANYBODY talk you into what you cant do!! Dude....68 and retired is most likely what's going there, with plenty of DOWN time to sleep and eat. You bigger guys are always picking on us little guys.....LOL!!! |
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Post by uncleal on Feb 13, 2009 20:21:40 GMT -5
Holy moly, Rich, you're an animal!
I'm 62 and train four days a week, using a fairly high volume powerlifting/bodybuilding combo routine. Current cycle is:
Monday:
Legs: Squats, alternate weeks of hack squats and RDLs, calf raises
Triceps: CGBP and weighted dips
Shoulders: Seated barbell press, high pull, rear laterals
Wednesday:
Rear Train: Alternate weeks of deadlift/SLDL/power shrug with speed deadlift/rack pull/good morning, glute ham raise, reverse hyperextension
Back: Rows, weighted chins/pullups
Friday:
Chest: Bench press, lockouts, floor press
Biceps: barbell or DB curls, preacher curls, hammer curls
Saturday or Sunday:
GPP: Kettlebell swings, long jump off a low box, pushup with a clap, gripper
I do moderate cardio (C2 rower, elliptical, stair steeper) three times a week and walk two or three miles daily.
Right now, I'm not doing singles. Usually, my work sets for the powerlifts are 3x3. However, this is turning out to be a bit much once I reach 90% 1RM. I think I'll switch to two sets of three reps, so I can progress, rather than wave back to 80% and try again.
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Post by RichHutchison on Feb 14, 2009 13:47:27 GMT -5
JP nailed it. I have LOTS of down time. Not retired, just chronically underemployed.  I've always marveled over guys who do physical work and still have the energy to lift seriously. Kudos to them. My workout times are like the proverbial gas in a vacuum; expanding to the limits of the space available. Got no life. |
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jp
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Posts: 183
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Post by jp on Feb 14, 2009 15:25:14 GMT -5
JP nailed it. I have LOTS of down time. Not retired, just chronically underemployed. I've always marveled over guys who do physical work and still have the energy to lift seriously. Kudos to them. My workout times are like the proverbial gas in a vacuum; expanding to the limits of the space available. Got no life. LOL!! "Chronically underemployed".... |
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Post by quadancer on Aug 30, 2009 19:19:13 GMT -5
I do construction and manage to train 3x/wk, but mostly because it's so sporadic. Going from BB routines to basic PL work (Korte now) I'll be hanged if I'm not gaining beef! Weight is staying under 215 but recomp has me looking much bigger, albeit a little fat. Reading Faleev and Korte got me interested in trying the simple method first and it's working- for now.
I'm a carpenter at times and at 56, I turn into a flat tire by day's end, and some days chronic fatigue seems to be my nemesis. I have found that by getting rid of a con artist partner (in-law) my energy levels improved. I'm more sensitive to stress than I used to be.
I try to lift mid-mornings whenever possible when I'm strongest.
I'll lift tired before not lifting at all. Ibuprofin works.
Atro-phex doesn't screw with my nerves and is okay if taken before 1:00 pm.
Korte seems too easy in the first month, so I added chins, shrugs and one curl set on day 3 to maintain mass.
No matter what system I do, I'm always an hour and a quarter to two hours in the gym. PL work has me taking more rest between sets and that sits VERY nicely with me. I love training again, and new toys always inspire...like the new bench form...my bench WAS the weakest until PL technique shot it up.
I stopped training at home because it was getting down to 45 minutes and less results. I missed people.
Now I'm at a "fitness" gym, it's a mix of hello's, helping guys out, and trying to stay out of convos so I can train ME. The headphones help a lot, not to mention I only like metal to train on. And they play BeeGees and stuff. Urp.
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