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Post by dopar66 on Jan 24, 2006 12:19:50 GMT -5
I'm not as hardline in my opinion as some others. I feel two years is enough for someone to get off a banned substance if they choose to lift truly raw (that means no assistance, right?). Also gives them plenty time to think, time to train without pharmaceutical enhancement, time to commit to personal integrity.
Here's one you can chisel in stone. Second offense: permanent ban. My two cents.
God Bless.
Doug
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2006 13:14:42 GMT -5
Doug, I agree with your assessment. I also think that if someone comes over from another organization where they were serving a suspension, then they should be drug tested and if the results are negative, the time under suspension from the previous organization plus a probationary period from RAW would not exceed 2 years.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2006 10:00:48 GMT -5
I have to say a life time ban is needed. Only becuase I feel that if they are willing to "cheat" by using illegal gear and claim they are natural and raw, then they cant be trusted. I have met several people who claim to be natural and were not. They have it in their heads that as long as they dont take "allot" of gear, only moderate amounts, then they consider it to be natural.
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Post by jimray on Feb 21, 2006 10:54:46 GMT -5
Not all positive test results are because of intentional cheating. It is possible to test positive because of something you didn't know about, or were mistaken about. Should that person be held accountable? Yes, but a lifetime ban would excessive, IMO.
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Post by eclipse on May 1, 2006 16:26:55 GMT -5
Not all positive test results are because of intentional cheating. True... A quality lab must be used with more than one test from the same sample if a negative result is detected. The consequences of a failed test reach far beyond the ban itself. Especially in the legal and moral environments in which we live. The media has brought testing to the forefront. As an organization we need to be aware of the implications. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2006 22:20:36 GMT -5
First offense = 1 year ban
Second offense = Gone Forever, we're all big boys and girls 1 chance to redeem yourself period.
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Post by 3speed on Nov 22, 2006 13:45:46 GMT -5
First offense= 2 year ban and the lifter has to pay for his own drug tests at future meets.
Second offense=You're outta here!!!!
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fatty
Full Member
Posts: 130
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Post by fatty on May 16, 2007 22:51:04 GMT -5
We are attempting to recruit more quality lifters into this organization.
Most of the others organizations are basically "clean" the day of the meet. I have no personal problem with the 5 year drug-free waiver but your taking a guys word for it--period. If they have no problem with lying they will slip thru, while others have been drug-free for an admitted 3 years and must wait 2 more years to compete in the organization? How does this recruit more lifters? What does this have to be with being RAW?
Cetain medical conditions require Testosterone or HRT therapy. Losing lifters because they taked their legitamate prescriptions and still test within the normal testosterone range are cheaters? BS. No different then being on a blood pressure medication that has a diaretic in it. Ladies on the pill.
If some Joe is open to discuss his persoanl medical condition with the director, explain why he is prescribed HRT, he should be madatory tested everytime he lifts but if he is in the normal range-he's fine.
Yes, I have trained with a couple lifters on HRT and for them not to compete is such a waste to powerlifting. They are forced to compete in backyard meets with guys juiced to the color blue and they are only taking their medicine.
That is not an even playing field to be painted by the same brush? Cheaters--no way.
BTW 2 years clean to lift. That dude is clean.
1st offense-2 year suspension
2nd offense-Hasta amigo
BTW-I am not the sharpest tack in the drawer but if a guy tests positive isn't that an automatic "5" year suspension? If this is a 5 years clean organization would he have to wait madatory 5 to get back in? Persoanlly, 5 years is way to long for a clean period or a 1st time suspension. I guess we will let the boss decide.
$.02
Fatty
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Post by isbell on May 19, 2007 12:55:59 GMT -5
2 yrs.
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Post by George on May 29, 2007 23:38:11 GMT -5
Not all positive test results are because of intentional cheating. It is possible to test positive because of something you didn't know about, or were mistaken about. Should that person be held accountable? Yes, but a lifetime ban would excessive, IMO. I have never really got into supplements. In high school we were on the creatine and andro kick, ripped fuel and ultamate orange (before the orange was banned). Nothing seemed to work for me and I took the road of supplement companies just making money. I know better now as far as protein and some others, but if people have knowledge of things which can be purchased over the counter that could cause a negative test let me know or send me a link. A lot of people have been asking me about this as well who are planning on competing in the Tri-State meet and I would like to give them a general answer. Thanks. Also...I agree with a 1 year ban on first offense, lifetime on the second. |
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Post by pwrlftr on Jul 16, 2007 16:18:51 GMT -5
In the late 90s and early 2000 a lot of lifters tested positive for drugs which later were found to come from contaminated supplements where the supplement maker was not cleaning up after producing their prohormones. Now that prohormones are banned you have seen less of this. Having lifted for over 35 years now drug free I think I know this game pretty well. Many of the people who have gotten positive tests did so out of ignorance and had no intention of taking anything. This is a very complex issue. Having lifted in every drug tested federation I can say that each federation has its protected lifters who know how and what to use to get around the tests.
I would suggest out of meet testing and polygraphs if you can afford them. Until this mess gets cleaned up I would not be so high and mighty about banning people for life. I cite the Olympics for example. Do you think every athelete there is drug free. One of my best friends was on the Olympic committee for years and things he shared with me about the politics, drug cheating and other things turned my stomach.
But then I'm big hearted and believe everyone deserves a second and sometimes a third chance. We don't even give murderers life time sentences in most cases without the chance of rehabilitation so why should we not be open to anyone who has a change of heart having another chance. You can always drug test them at any time to make sure they are honest about the change. Until we put aside our sanctimonious hypocrisy we will never clean up any of our sports but then that's just my thoughts and I could be wrong.
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fatty
Full Member
Posts: 130
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Post by fatty on Jul 16, 2007 16:25:14 GMT -5
Pwrlftr
Welcome aboard. I appreciate your well thought out and professional post. Most of your points I agree with you on.
Thanks for bringing that to the table.
Fatty
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Post by pwrlftr on Jul 17, 2007 13:20:17 GMT -5
Thank You Fatty,
I'm glad to be here. You guys have a lot of interesting and informative things on this forum. Even though I'm old I'm always open to new ideas. I love this sport and it thrills me to see the passion of you young guys for it.
Drugs in sport is a complex issue and god bless anyone who can come up with a workable solution. I can tell you that it is so much better today than when I started competing you can't imagine. So the good news is we have made a lot of progress. Just beware of supplements. Take as few as you can since most are a waste of money and beware of anything that says it can build your testosterone or is the next greatest thing. Yeah right, I'd like to have a dollar for every time I've read that in a magazine.
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Post by timhenriques on Jul 28, 2007 20:41:00 GMT -5
I think 1-3 year ban for first offense, lifetime ban for second offense, however I think this should only be used for urine tests. There are too many problems with the polygraph and too many false positives to do a lifetime ban off of that IMO.
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Post by 3speed on Jul 29, 2007 6:48:18 GMT -5
Agree with Tim on this one. I was subject to random polygraphs while in the Air Force. I took 4 of them. I passed 2 of them and the other 2 were aborted because a baseline could not be established. I was too nervous about the polygraph to establish the baseline. These were FBI professionals not some locals. If I were to fail a polygraph at a meet, I would demand a urinalysis or blood work.
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Post by teen117titan on Jul 30, 2007 20:11:52 GMT -5
Lifetime
no reason for that
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Esseff
Junior Member
Posts: 67 
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Post by Esseff on Aug 1, 2014 1:03:50 GMT -5
We are attempting to recruit more quality lifters into this organization. Most of the others organizations are basically "clean" the day of the meet. I have no personal problem with the 5 year drug-free waiver but your taking a guys word for it--period. If they have no problem with lying they will slip thru, while others have been drug-free for an admitted 3 years and must wait 2 more years to compete in the organization? How does this recruit more lifters? What does this have to be with being RAW? Cetain medical conditions require Testosterone or HRT therapy. Losing lifters because they taked their legitamate prescriptions and still test within the normal testosterone range are cheaters? BS. No different then being on a blood pressure medication that has a diaretic in it. Ladies on the pill.
If some Joe is open to discuss his persoanl medical condition with the director, explain why he is prescribed HRT, he should be madatory tested everytime he lifts but if he is in the normal range-he's fine.
Yes, I have trained with a couple lifters on HRT and for them not to compete is such a waste to powerlifting. They are forced to compete in backyard meets with guys juiced to the color blue and they are only taking their medicine.That is not an even playing field to be painted by the same brush? Cheaters--no way. BTW 2 years clean to lift. That dude is clean. 1st offense-2 year suspension 2nd offense-Hasta amigo BTW-I am not the sharpest tack in the drawer but if a guy tests positive isn't that an automatic "5" year suspension? If this is a 5 years clean organization would he have to wait madatory 5 to get back in? Persoanlly, 5 years is way to long for a clean period or a 1st time suspension. I guess we will let the boss decide. $.02 Fatty This speaks to me. I have a heart condition for which I take a beta-blocker. Apparently that goes against the rules. I have spoken to the 100% Raw Powerlifting South Africa chaps about this and they say all I need is a doctors note and its fine. I get the whole raw philosophy and completely agree with it but space should be made for us that need to take medication; it's not like I choose to have a bum ticker. And I'd hate to have to compete against juiced guys simply because of a beta blocker. |
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Post by 3speed on Aug 1, 2014 17:27:16 GMT -5
Esseff: The info you received is wrong and I will be looking into this. A note from your doctor is not what is needed. You need to file for a Therapeutic Use Exemption (TUE) with the federation. A simplified TUE can be filed for beta agonists. Your doctor will have to fill it out and you have to submit it, along with supporting medical documents, to the drug chairman for review. You can compete while taking beta blockers as long as you have an approved TUE on file. If you compete and get tested without the TUE in place, you will return a positive result and be placed on a 2 year ban from the federation. You can read about this in the rules here: rawpowerlifting.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/100_Raw_General_Rules_2014_Final-2.pdf |
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Esseff
Junior Member
Posts: 67
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Post by Esseff on Aug 2, 2014 13:09:09 GMT -5
I was at a meet today, as a spectator. (100% Raw Powerlifting SA). I spoke to one of the directors and told what you said and he said it wasn't necessary, a note from my cardiologist is fine.
I'm not arguing one way or the other. I just want these guys to put that in writing so I can compete. Don't want to be turned/disqualified/banned because of a misunderstanding.
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Post by 3speed on Aug 3, 2014 8:23:39 GMT -5
Esseff, I understand that you aren't arguing but, you are being given bad information. I set up the drug testing program for 100% RAW and wrote the drug testing rules. I administered the program as Vice President of Drug Testing for several years before stepping down. What they are telling you is wrong. They are not adhering to the rules of the federation as they are required to do in order to hold sanctioned meets. I will speak with Paul Bossi about this.
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Esseff
Junior Member
Posts: 67
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Post by Esseff on Aug 3, 2014 12:25:25 GMT -5
I will email them tomorrow and send them the link above. I don't mind doing whatever paper is required so long as I'm doing it properly.
Update coming once I hear back.
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Esseff
Junior Member
Posts: 67
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Post by Esseff on Aug 4, 2014 5:35:43 GMT -5
Esseff: The info you received is wrong and I will be looking into this. A note from your doctor is not what is needed. You need to file for a Therapeutic Use Exemption (TUE) with the federation. A simplified TUE can be filed for beta agonists. Your doctor will have to fill it out and you have to submit it, along with supporting medical documents, to the drug chairman for review. You can compete while taking beta blockers as long as you have an approved TUE on file. If you compete and get tested without the TUE in place, you will return a positive result and be placed on a 2 year ban from the federation. You can read about this in the rules here: rawpowerlifting.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/100_Raw_General_Rules_2014_Final-2.pdfThe link to the actual TUE file doesn't work. Where else can I get it? |
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Post by 3speed on Aug 4, 2014 19:26:18 GMT -5
You can find what you need at the end of the following document. You need to print out the form and have it filled out by your doctor. www.usada.org/substances/tue/apply/You will have to ignore page 4 and contact the Drug Testing Chairman for 100% RAW at nutritek601@yahoo.com He will let you know how to submit your application. |
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